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[#75885] Written by: minus0ne [25/01/2008, 20:03]
buffy? sci-fi? lmao.
[#75902] Written by: theconundrumm [26/01/2008, 02:48]
laugh you arse off all you want buddy... lookie like the laughs are on you...

[let the definition debate begin (?)][yawn]
[#75905] Written by: The Walker [26/01/2008, 03:37]
Quote by tvfan
well the last i heard, vampires were science fiction...not real.[/
quote]

since when?

what's science got to do with vampires? ..they come under the same genre as any
myth or fairytale.. fantasy.

you probably count goblins, elves and dragons as sci-fi too, huh?

lmao.

... and btw theconundrumm, if it was that much of a yawn, why did you feel the
need to chip in?

[#75907] Written by: [26/01/2008, 04:24]
says it best:

in organizational or marketing contexts, science fiction can be synonymous with
the broader definition of speculative fiction, encompassing creative works
incorporating imaginative elements not found in contemporary reality; this
includes fantasy, horror, and related genres.
[#75909] Written by: The Walker [26/01/2008, 05:05]
Quote by loudsavlon
says it best:

in organizational or marketing contexts, science fiction can be synonymous with
the broader definition of speculative fiction, encompassing creative works
incorporating imaginative elements not found in contemporary reality; this
includes fantasy, horror, and related genres.


source?... respectable or indicative? i think not.

the operative word being marketing.. when did they ever accurately classify
something.. the marketing industry is entirely aimed at the gulible who believe
their bull anyway,.. and it's only the gulible and terminally dumb who would
lump all those things together under the banner of sci fi, so they suit each
other quite well, and as for the 'organisational context', it only exists as
such because marketing can't classify specifics, by their very definition they
try to reach as large a demographic as possible.

anyone who would seriously lump all of those things under the banner of science
fiction can honestly call it wantever the hell they want, because quite
frankly, someone with so little a grasp of their genres, in a context such as
this thread, has no right to an opinion.

anyway... would you classify tolkien as sci-fi? no i didn't think so, but the
article would.. so what makes it relevent to everything else but not to tolkien?

the article's definition is a pos... if they all must be classified
under the same heading, then it would be that of 'speculative fiction'.
[#75917] Written by: justcommenting [26/01/2008, 06:44]
Quote by santabj
the walker - you're an idiot.

coming from one who *writes* science fiction; buffy indeed fits the bill.
fantasy is a subgenre.


anyone can write, and anyone can say they write. if i write a 10 page novella, can i call myself a writer?
sure. does that give anything i say on the subject any more credibility? of course not. readers and others
can know and understand just as much just as well.

fantasy is not a subgenre. scifi is speculative fiction specifically centred around science, hence the name.
fantasy straight up is not. science fantasy is, however.

that said, for an internet fan organisation or whatever, it hardly matters. but no need to call people idiots
for nitpicking, especially if they're for most intents and purposes quite correct.

p.s. the vampire episode of smallville was actually scifi/scifan so these rules aren't hard and fast.
[#75937] Written by: kurai [26/01/2008, 12:25]
heh
this is a years [decades] old debate. the lumping together of sci-fi &
fantasy is purely an act of convenience on the part of publishers and
retailers marketing strategies.

there's a lot of crossover and blurring, naturally, which isn't so hard to
understand given the speculative core of each, but when you look at things
like awards bodies and whatnot comprised of entrants an panelists actually in
the business of writing there's a pretty clear demarcation between the two.

a broader attempt at definition might be something along the lines of sci-fi
being specualtion about things that *might* be possible, and fantasy being
speculation about things that certainly *aren't* possible.

[#75970] Written by: The Walker [26/01/2008, 19:51]
Quote by santabj
the walker - you're an idiot.

coming from one who *writes* science fiction; buffy indeed fits the bill.
fantasy is a subgenre.


not very fuqing good at though eh? especially if you think fantasy is a subgenre
of sci-fi, you're reduced to (irrelevent) bragging and calling people idiots on
the internet..lol!!
[#75990] Written by: theconundrumm [27/01/2008, 00:01]
the walker... clearly i meant the oncoming debate was a [yawn]... as pointed out
above, there really is no debate... get a clue...
[#75992] Written by: The Walker [27/01/2008, 00:27]
oh, i do have a clue, but certain other people don't.. wh is why such a 'debate'
as you put it, is relevant.. although it's not really a matter for debate, just
a matter of some people accepting what is.

...but i'm glad you popped by just to yawn at us all.
[#75996] Written by: theconundrumm [27/01/2008, 02:44]
from wikipedia [yeah yeah, i know... but... all of the text below has been
culled from books by noted authoritative authors ]

science fiction is largely based on writing entertainingly and rationally about
alternate possibilities in settings that are contrary to known reality. these
include:

* a setting in the future, in alternative time lines, or in a historical
past that contradicts known facts of history or the archeological record
* a setting in outer space, on other worlds, or involving aliens
* stories that contradict known or supposed laws of nature
* stories that involve discovery or application of new scientific
principles, such as time travel or psionics, or new technology, such as
nanotechnology, faster-than-light travel or robots, or of new and different
political or social systems

exploring the consequences of such differences is the traditional purpose of
science fiction, making it a "literature of ideas".



honestly, it seems to be only narrow minded, or uninformed folk who seem to
think that sci-fi has to be set on a space ship and have laser guns... again,
i'll state, 'there is no debate'...

edit: kurai, i like that last paragraph there.... interesting take on things...
[#76016] Written by: The Walker [27/01/2008, 11:45]
Quote by theconundrumm

honestly, it seems to be only narrow minded, or uninformed folk who seem to
think that sci-fi has to be set on a space ship and have laser guns... again,
i'll state, 'there is no debate'...


(to the first quote)i agree.. was there someone who didn't?

what's your point?

as long as some people are hazy on the demarkation between the genres that i
think that there is at least need for clarification, if not debate.

Quote by theconundrumm
science fiction is largely based on writing entertainingly
and rationally about
alternate possibilities in settings that are contrary to known reality. these
include:

* a setting in the future, in alternative time lines, or in a historical
past that contradicts known facts of history or the archeological record
* a setting in outer space, on other worlds, or involving aliens
* stories that contradict known or supposed laws of nature
* stories that involve discovery or application of new scientific
principles, such as time travel or psionics, or new technology, such as
nanotechnology, faster-than-light travel or robots, or of new and different
political or social systems


(to the second quote)again.. and, so, what... yes, that is the generally
accepted explaination
of science fiction..what about it? show me somewhere in there that allows for
the existance of a metaphysically related vampire..,yes, it allows for a
'vampire' created by some scientific explanation.. for example as the book..'i
am legend', where they were the results of a virus.. that can be said to
be science fiction, or at the very least science fantasy... but it doesn't allow
for
the existance of your classical vampire.. the demon, devil or black magic,
vampire bat related ones.... of which the 'buffy' type of vampire certainly is.

all you have done, is wander into a thread, with your head in the clouds and
support an opinion that has alrady been made. mine.. thank you.

(admins.. you seriously need to fix your bloody site.. it can't even handle it's
basic coding instructions consistanly.. it's ability to quote and separate said
quoting is all over the place!)
[#76088] Written by: theconundrumm [28/01/2008, 18:28]
Quote by the walker
show me somewhere in there that allows for
the existance of a metaphysically related vampire..,yes, it allows for a
\\\'vampire\\\' created by some scientific explanation.. for example as the
book..\\\'i
am legend\\\', where they were the results of a virus.. that can be said to
be science fiction, or at the very least science fantasy... but it doesn\\\'t allow
for
the existance of your classical vampire.. the demon, devil or black magic,
vampire bat related ones.... of which the \\\'buffy\\\' type of vampire certainly
is.


Quote by theconundrumm

* stories that contradict known or supposed laws of nature


i guess it would be that one.... head in the clouds much?
[#76096] Written by: The Walker [28/01/2008, 19:59]

Quote by theconundrumm

* stories that contradict known or supposed laws of nature


i guess it would be that one.... head in the clouds much?


yes... in terms of the technological and scientific ,not, paranormal, metaphysical
or ghosties and f**king ghoolies.... are you arguing just for the hell of it..
because no one could honsetly be as obtuse as you are being with out some serious
damage in the head area.

spout dumb arguements much?
[#76114] Written by: knuckles [28/01/2008, 23:25]
ever actually seen buffy? there are quite a few episodes that i would have
defined as "sci fi," including an entire season where the antagonist was a robot....
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